Ep. 1982: The Price of Excitement

SPEAKER_03 0:50

Oh my gosh, I'm so excited about today's show. My goodness, the excitement is running so high because I love excitement. I love the fact that we get excited about investments

Selling the Sizzle

SPEAKER_03 1:01

because you know what? Those exciting investments, well, they do really well, don't they? Hello again and welcome to another exciting Monday edition of the Talking Real Money Podcast. Mondays are Financial Physics Day. And today, once again, we are reading from the good book of financial physics, chapter 10. We're already up to chapter 10. So what we're we're getting close to halfway through.

SPEAKER_05 1:28

Yeah, it which by the way, that'll be a big day for me when we're more than halfway. Very exciting. So looking forward to that.

SPEAKER_03 1:34

Really? When is I don't even have my copy of the book in front of me. I know you have it.

SPEAKER_05 1:38

I haven't seen it in 30 years, but I'm reading it every day, every night. It's only been right next to my bed, four and two. I wrote it tw 16 years ago. Yeah. Okay. You've got a this is a you got a picture of somebody climbing a like like a mountain that curls back behind their. I don't know how they well, it's exciting.

SPEAKER_03 1:54

Yeah, but the risks are a little high. Yeah, the risks are high. That was what it what it was supposed to be.

SPEAKER_05 1:59

Excitement to risk ratio. That's what rule 10, selling the sizzle. You know, any chapter that has stake on the first page, you're getting my attention for sure. I mean, that's I'm I'm in. I'm in on that. So and what are we talking about here? What we're talking about here is at the end of the day, a lot of people want something that's new. They want something that's unusual, and they want something exciting. Uh sadly, that's a lot of what investing people think that's what you need to be to be successful, too. You gotta be ahead of the crowd. I gotta I gotta find out the these things before my neighbor does. Um, and you going back to your sales experience at Dean Witter, good old Dean Witter, where where the training was all about selling Sears Financial Network. Not so much about actually how investments work, but that doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_03 2:46

And no, as a matter of fact, I remember the cold call cowboy. Yeah, right. Bill Good. Smile and dial, baby. Yeah, boy, and it was always about selling the sizzle, not the stake, because the stakes we were selling weren't all that attractive.

SPEAKER_05 2:57

Yeah, I mean, in the book, you mentioned that uh we were told to create a great story or weave an exciting tale, the sizzle, if we hope to make the sale. Tell us more about that. What what does that mean?

SPEAKER_03 3:08

Well, it's okay, in an environment that is highly competitive, and it wasn't that competitive back in 1983 when I entered the financial services business as a young rookie broker, uh, but uh there were still people, there were there were products out there that uh were better than what we were selling. There was, in essence, USDA Prime, and we were selling nearly dog food. Uh there were you could you could get no-load funds, most of them were actively managed back then. You could get a couple of no-load index funds, and I do mean only a couple, but we were selling high commission products that were engineered to make it appear you could get more money, and they often failed miserably at doing that, with high fees and expenses, and we had to make a sale. We to make the sale, we had to tell a story. Yeah, it that's all about the story, right? It's all about the story. For example, we used to sell this was back in the uh double digit inflation period, and we used to sell because people wanted safety, we used to sell a government bond fund that was um government bond plus fund. That was Schwab's? No, this is Dean Witter's government bond funds.

SPEAKER_05 4:23

Okay, I thought Schwab had one that was something plus, and then they found the government.

SPEAKER_03 4:27

And the plus was uh was was using options to stretch for yield. Yeah. So they were trying to get a higher yield, so we could tell people, well, this bond fund has a two percent higher yield than Treasury's, but it's just as safe. And oh, and the other lie we came up with back then in the good old days, because of no load funds cropping up, was the fact that we would say, we were told to say with our mouths, and this is a no-load fund, because people go, Well, I heard about those no-load funds, you know, the no commission funds. Oh, yeah, this is a no-load fund, when in fact we were selling what was what was referred to as a liar load fund, uh, where there was no upfront sales fee. We just collected it every year in a higher annual fee.

SPEAKER_05 5:11

So, okay, so in the book, the author says Um the observation is the more exciting or compelling the story, the riskier the investment. That's a fascinating uh observation.

SPEAKER_03 5:24

It almost has to be, because the excitement, the only excitement that excites an investor is the excitement of higher returns. So if you are going to perfect examples over the over the years, CDOs, CMOs, CLOs, collateralized blank obligations that continued to promise investors a much higher return than they could get on comparably safe government securities. And yet they were supposedly backed by government securities, but it was uh a a backing that really was complexity and hope backed. They hoped that it worked out the way their algorithm said it would work out, and in the case of all three, there are multiple cases of these complex products failing to live up to what the industry expected and certainly what the investors expected.

SPEAKER_05 6:24

Yeah, and today it I think if you ask the average person on the street what's what's cool, what's exciting on Wall Street, they would say you know, the SpaceX initial public offering, right? I mean, that's it got a lot of press. It was, I think, the biggest IPO in history. This thing is gonna launch, it's gonna be in a new orbit all by itself. Sorry for the bad pun. But and and and this people called me. You know, like how much of that should I get? I really want some of this for my kids. This is really exciting. And uh let's see, it came out on the launch.

SPEAKER_03 7:01

Let's see, it came six weeks ago, a couple months ago. I want to get the exact time frame. It came out June, no, June uh twelfth. So yeah, a couple months, yeah. At $150 a share. Yes. It immediately rose because of all that excitement to $161 a share. And oh no, I'm sorry. Then the the subsequent day it rank rank rose to over two hundred. Wow.

SPEAKER_04 7:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 7:27

So it got to two hundred dollars a share by the sixteenth of June. And that was the best it's done.

SPEAKER_05 7:35

Yeah, and so three months later it's basically. So getting excited. Uh by the way, I also looked up because you you asked about expensive in your in your book here. You know there's an ETF that you can have an expense ratio of 12.4%. I it's serious. They're which one is that case. Uh the Confluence BDC and Specialty Income Fund FBDC has an expense ratio of 12.4%. Uh I didn't look up what they're doing in there that's cre that's cost so costly, but uh it must be exciting because that is 12%. There's a few others that are crazy. Uh the Militia Long Short Fund O R R at 10.9%. Uh, folks, these are products that you should stay, you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:30

All this thing owns Galaxy away from. That's crazy. They own some of these um crazy lending stocks like Blue Owl.

SPEAKER_05 8:38

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 8:38

They own Blue Owl, they own Behrings. Uh so these are pretty dangerous lending stocks, and they own these major positions. They have uh 13% of their portfolio in one stock. That's just crazy.

SPEAKER_05 8:51

Uh I mean, that sort of concentration, but that sort of cost. And again, this would be something that you'd say, whoa, I want to be part of that because that's private uh uh lending. Private lending, yeah. Yeah, that is private lending. I I wanted some of my portfolio in that. The other one that is still, I think today, if you ask people, would be uh cryptocurrency, especially Bitcoin.

SPEAKER_03 9:12

Oh, there was a really great article like uh a few weeks ago in the Wall Street Journal. It was a wonderful article. I uh the headline was for many individual traders, prediction markets are hot now.

SPEAKER_04 9:23

Yes, I do.

SPEAKER_03 9:24

And crypto is not. Because now the most exciting thing is is betting on prediction markets. This all proves, by the way, when you're willing to play excitement, that proves that the it that this is more greed and and even gambling driven than we might otherwise like to believe. We like to believe we're rational investors, but apparently uh these exciting prospects of big riches really quickly are the hallmarks. They're the hallmarks of gambling.

SPEAKER_05 9:58

Yeah, and you get to the uh a long run of a bull market like we've had now, and I think there's more of it. I think people think, well, I've I gotta get in, I gotta get part of this. So they they they ignore the rules. And one of the rules comes from a Nobel Prize winner who said investing should be like watching grass grow. Remember that? That goes way back.

SPEAKER_03 10:17

That's Harry Markowitz.

SPEAKER_05 10:19

That's right, you know, and that's so important. Um, and Harry would tell you that you need to accept market returns. That uh, you know, the balance, whatever your balance between stocks and bonds is, be diversified, keep your fees low, pay tech taxes.

SPEAKER_03 10:33

Isn't that funny? That's that's you know, a lot of the intros to this show, not the one for the financial physics, but if you listen to a lot of the intros to the show, you'll see you'll hear that theme repeated among all of the various talented singers we use.

SPEAKER_05 10:45

And then the other, speaking of singers is the the other one that's hard. And if you saw the Odyssey, you understand this. Avoiding the siren songs. That's the way I put it. I mean, because there's so many voices out there that are telling you, you got to do this. This is exciting, you really got to be in on this. And it's always urgent and it's always exciting. And I love that the author points out that uh that's that's not the way to invest in the long haul.

SPEAKER_03 11:07

Yeah, it's not the way to invest at all. Um, it's the it's a way generally again, I want to go back to it. We really need to find a way in our little pea brains sometimes to make the distinction. And it's a it's a pretty strong distinction between investing and gambling. We like to call gambling investing because it makes us feel like better people, like we're not just, you know, spendthrifts throwing money away. But when you are in the prediction markets, when you're in crypto, when you're even in FBDC betting on the specialty finance industry, you're now in the realm of gambling. Period. It's not investing. Sorry, I know it makes you feel better to think of it as investing, but you are just the only person you're hurting long term is you, but we don't want you to hurt you. Uh-oh. You got very quiet. Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_05 12:04

Yeah, I I'm I'm I was gonna go to the questions there.

SPEAKER_03 12:08

Oh, oh, you wanted me to go to the questions there. That's why I was pointing at you. I couldn't see it because I was reading an article.

SPEAKER_05 12:13

I was reading the article about No, it's just a whatever you're gonna do to go into the questions. I'm gonna edit this part.

SPEAKER_03 12:19

Oh, do we just this is just questions, right? Just reading them?

SPEAKER_05 12:23

Yes, sir.

Questions Begin

SPEAKER_03 12:29

Now that we've become a little less excited, now that we've calmed down a bit, it's time to do something we try to do every show as long as you help us out with your questions that you send in at talkingrealmoney.com on the ask a question button form, or you record using the microphone in the lower right-hand corner. Those get answered on Fridays. You just send your question in at talkingrealmoney.com, and then this incredibly complex process occurs. You set into motion a series of events that lead to the destruction of plant material of some kind somewhere, as Tom takes those electronic questions that you dutifully typed with your fingers on a keyboard, and for some reason he insists on turning them into paper so that he can read them like this.

SPEAKER_05 13:14

And every time you do that, I look out the window at those big trees and think, wait, that that tree, here's that. It could just fall right over on me. It really kind of frightens me.

SPEAKER_03 13:21

So they're not using the big trees

Advisor Meeting Frequency

SPEAKER_03 13:23

anymore. They they've got a cheaper ways to do that.

SPEAKER_05 13:26

Yeah, they do. Uh, this question comes from Blanco, Texas. The writer does not want us to use his name, which is fine. We won't. We try not to.

SPEAKER_03 13:34

We use first names, but not last.

SPEAKER_05 13:36

I'm gonna go anonymous on the next podcast, too. My wife and I continue to enjoy your podcast and feel that your insights and responses to previous questions as submitted online have added tangible value to our financial journey. We also highly respect the fact that both of you, Tom and Don, make no secret about having a role with Apella Wealth, but that does not mean your comments are simply pimping for a Pella. Pimping for Appella. I like that. We're not Appella Pimps. It's good to know.

SPEAKER_03 14:02

Uh I'm definitely not an Appella pimp. No, I'm not even an advisor anymore. I gave all that up.

SPEAKER_05 14:07

Yeah. This transparency and straightforward approach is all too rare in the financial advisory industry. That's very kind. Thank you, he says. Which takes us to our question. We have been very pleased with our current advisor and believe that we are a valued client. Our portfolio meets a dollar figure, which qualifies for their lowest fees within their four-tier T fee system, which in our view speaks to the fact that our portfolio should be substantial enough to be valuable to them. One might think. We try hard not to bother them through the year by looking over their shoulder or tapping them for information unless it's a matter of significant importance. By the way, anything with your money could be considered significant importance. Um, back to the note. We have never imposed our will on how they manage our account. I would estimate our unscheduled calls to their office may be in the order of half a dozen times a year. We do have two 45-minute video conferences each year when we discuss current needs, portfolio, and any relevant topics. I have expressed my desire to share a video conference on a quarterly basis, not twice a year. I've indicated that they don't need to be deep dives, but maybe a 30-minute touch to keep everyone aligned and up to speed. To my surprise, my request has met pushback by the team, and the discussion was basically left with we'll talk about it internally. Is my request unreasonable?

SPEAKER_03 15:28

Not unreasonable at all. Uh I mean, you're the client. And and you know, I I don't know what the difference between having two hourlies a year and having four half hourly. Let me help you with the math. There's not much. Yeah. I I mean I was doing the math, but I wanted to make sure I was right.

SPEAKER_05 15:44

I think you were there on that one.

SPEAKER_03 15:46

Here's the thing that you in at in any firm, and and I've worked for multiple firms, Tom's worked for a couple of firms. In any firm, you're gonna have clients who want to spend a little more time with you and clients who want to spend a little less time with you. And that tends to balance out pretty well. And I think your request is very reasonable. As a matter of fact, it would probably, and this is probably something you should mention, it would very likely cut down on some of those unscheduled calls because you would feel better informed and feel less of a need to contact them between meetings. Um I would ask, though, just curious, why you need all that base touching.

SPEAKER_05 16:29

Well, that I was just gonna get to that. I mean, if you said, hey, I want to chat with you four times a year, I'd say fine. Yeah. It's gonna get kind of boring unless we're talking about our grandkids or something else, because there's really not that much to do every quarter. I mean, other than, you know, rebalancing or something significant happened in your life. But otherwise, I'm gonna say, you know, what what do you want to know? And there are people, by the way, that call me on a regular basis. I got a guy that you know that calls me very regularly. I think he just likes to make sure we're still here. And that is absolutely fine.

SPEAKER_03 16:58

And yeah, and the bay and and my guess is that, sir, those will be less than 30 minutes, as Tom was alluding to, because a good advisor who does who creates portfolios the way they should be created isn't gonna have much to share with you about the portfolio. Yep, we're still the same. Yep, market goes up, market goes down. Yep, market goes up more than it goes down. Yep, you you're globally diversified. Yep, we rebalanced. There we're done.

SPEAKER_05 17:24

Yeah, and and a lot of it is reassurance. Uh, well, I'm worried because fill in the blank. The war continues, inflation's still high, the market's record high. Even those answers are gonna end up being the same every time every single time.

SPEAKER_03 17:37

So if you think you're gonna talk to an advisor and get a different answer next time, well, then you should be worried about your advisor. If your advisor gives you different answers depending on the world's situation, then you don't have the right kind of advisor. No, I concur there.

SPEAKER_05 17:53

Uh you know, I guess if you came to us and said we have to meet every quarter, we would discuss it internally and then get back to you. No, sorry. Uh we'd probably make that work. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:05

So I I mean, I don't see why not. It's the same amount of time. Um sometimes the management is going to get pushback from advisors because it's going to change the way they schedule things.

SPEAKER_04 18:18

Yes, that's true.

SPEAKER_03 18:19

And but pretty sure most people could work that out.

SPEAKER_05 18:24

Yeah. And by the way, I think after you did it for a year, you'd be like, I don't really need to talk to you every night.

Music and Audiobook Update

SPEAKER_05 18:29

Let's go down to three. Yeah, let's let's let's do less. Uh, from Canton, Georgia, Jonathan writes, Hi, Tom and Don. I have a brief comment and a question. First, a comment. I love the show's investment content, but honestly, I only like the AI generated songs occasionally, not each episode. I guess I'm dull and boring now. Now the question, he says. I'm a retiree.

SPEAKER_03 18:50

All right, let me let me by the way, let me just comment on that. Which episodes do I do with and without? So, you know, I it's it's hard to know.

SPEAKER_05 18:56

I by the way, okay, that's this is a good time to uh mention the fact that your album, your AI generated album with the financial physicists is now available on most streaming services.

SPEAKER_03 19:08

Yes, for those who can't get enough of the music.

SPEAKER_05 19:11

Really want more.

SPEAKER_03 19:12

We do actually it's funny, I I keep track because we get we get notes through our website, we get notes through our our uh podcast host. Okay, yes, and then we get notes through our forms and things, and we get notes from a lot of different sources, and the current count is about between eight and ten to one in favor of the variety. People say they just kind of get a kick. It's only a minute at the beginning of the show. They get a kick out of seeing what the the the genre will be and what the uh the message will be for that particular and you'll find the message, like our previous question in every song is gonna be pretty much the same. Yeah, it's it's not varying very much, just like the quarterly meetings. And and oh, I wanted to mention this while we took a little break. Um you mentioned that the album is out, it's on all the major services. The Financial Physicist is the name of the band with an album.

SPEAKER_04 20:04

That's right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:05

And also, this was actually requested a lot. A ton of people wrote in saying, I don't like to read books, I like to listen to books. Please get your darned audiobook done. Well, let me tell you, the darned audiobook was a lot of work. And it just went up. Just went up on audio.

SPEAKER_04 20:27

It's recorded in your voice, I'm assuming. I recorded it, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 20:30

I this is your historical fiction book.

SPEAKER_03 20:32

This is my this is yes, not financial physics. I've never done a audiobook version of that for some reason. Because there's charts and things. Uh, but no, this is the line uncrossed, my fiction civil war book. It is available for all of you who asked as an audio book now on Audible and other audiobook services that are serviced by Audible, like Apple.

SPEAKER_05 20:53

Five stars, according to Tom Cock. So you might

Roll Over the 401k?

SPEAKER_05 20:56

want to check it out. All right, back to Jonathan's question. He says, I'm a retiree. I have funds in a Vanguard roll over IRA and Roth IRA. I also have funds in my last employer's 401k at Schwab. For simplicity, I'm considering rolling the Schwab 401k funds to Vanguard. Is there any advantage or reason to not do this? There's one. There's one.

SPEAKER_03 21:18

Well, okay.

SPEAKER_05 21:18

I mean There's only one because there's EDFs and yeah. But no, not that. There's only certain there are certain protections in some locations you get it being in an ERISA plan that you do not get in an IRA.

SPEAKER_03 21:30

Yes. The protections from potential creditors, uh in liability suits and that kind of thing. You get there can be some protections that you would lose if you go from a four oh one to an IRA. But if you're pretty sure you're not likely to be sued. Although who can know for sure, but you know, who can know will be alive tomorrow for sure. So life's a series of gambles and I would have uncertainty.

SPEAKER_05 22:00

The reason I would do it. Simplicity. The thing I see is regularly people come in the office, they have a lot of accounts, it's all over the place. Don't know exactly what their asset allocation is, but more importantly, uh, as we get older, harder to keep track of these things. So I'd prefer to see it in one place.

RMD Investing Choices

SPEAKER_05 22:16

Um, Janice from League City, Texas writes IRA distributed as 18% VOO, which I think is the SP 500.

SPEAKER_03 22:26

That's the SP 500 ETF. Yes.

SPEAKER_05 22:27

Remaining in VGSH, which I think is the Vanguard Short-Term Treasure Treasuries Fund. Um, so that's like a 2080, right? Yeah. 20% in stocks, 80% in the treasury.

SPEAKER_04 22:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:41

Have two annuities, one 100,000, the other 166,000. Have two CDs maturing in 2026 and 2027, $25,000 each. Listen to your podcast and learned a lot. Any suggestions for my distributions of VGS H and V O O? I'm assuming money that's coming out of the IRA. Um, concerns for growth and protection of principal, no children. Would you like some? Um no, kidding. So I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_03 23:08

Yours are all gone. You don't have any to spare anymore. I well, I can still Oh, the grandkids.

SPEAKER_05 23:13

That's right. They're they're they're pretty good. Um I guess the question is sort of when the money comes out of the IRA, what should I do with it? That's what I'm getting at here.

SPEAKER_03 23:21

Well, you go back and you reinvest it unless you need it to spend.

SPEAKER_05 23:24

Concerns for growth and protection of principle.

SPEAKER_03 23:27

Yeah, see, here's where this is the question. Growth and protection of principle. That makes me a little nervous. Makes me a little crazy. I want my money, and here's what I hear when I when I when I hear you say that. I don't want to lose any money, but I want to make a lot. That's right.

SPEAKER_05 23:43

Growth and protection of principle.

SPEAKER_03 23:45

You can't have both. You can only have a mix of the two. Now, I don't believe that VOO, even though it's well diversified, is adequately diversified if your goal is to reduce volatility. You are likely long term to have less volatility in a VT than a VOO because it has an international component to it. And Vanguard's short-term treasury fund is not going to be volatile at all.

SPEAKER_05 24:14

Uh the yield on that, it's got to be pretty slow pretty low right now, right?

SPEAKER_03 24:20

Maybe, maybe it depends on the look at the volatility first. Yeah, it's gonna be pretty quick. Yeah, it's worst year was again for all bond funds. Which year was that? That was it lost four percent to to BND's 14 ones or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No. Um right now, I would guess. Why can't I you know Morningstar has done some weird stuff with with the yields of B G S H. I'm gonna have to look it up again.

SPEAKER_05 24:52

Okay, while he's doing that, I will add this, by the way. This is step 50. The first step would be to decide overall what balance you want to have between stocks and bonds, back to your you know, protecting principle but getting growth. You could use the risk quiz for that, you could use a financial plan for that, and figure out how much risk you want to take to try to get what return. Then you work your way backwards, how much how it's positioned in the IRA, uh, how much I have in CDs, when the money comes out of the IRA, how it's invested, rather than waking up saying, oh, I got to take my RMD, what am I gonna do with it? Because it should be a part of your overall plan.

SPEAKER_03 25:30

Now, the yield is approximately ha uh half a point less than the B and D. So because the yield curve is relatively flat. It is from short maturities to long maturities, the yield is almost the same. It's a little bit higher at the long end. So you're looking at four-ish percent. But what you have with a VGSH is if rates are rising, you're gonna be a happy camper. Because the value of the bonds isn't gonna fall as far as fast, and your yield as they buy new bonds will steadily rise, which makes it probably a better stability vehicle, well, definitely a better stability vehicle than BND. But if in falling rate environments, BND is gonna hold its yield better and it's going to increase in value more. So it's a trade-off.

SPEAKER_05 26:16

Yeah, I'd rather see you spread that out a little bit into BND because you get some different types of bonds, but there's nothing wrong with that.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

I mean, we're quibbling over fractions. It really doesn't matter. But I think what the key is is your one, your stock to bond ratio, get that right. Is is safety more important than growth, then your stock to bond ratio right now may be pretty good. If you want a little more growth, you're very conservative right now, but still you could up your uh allocation to stocks, I believe, and still be similarly risky by getting VT instead of VOO because it gives you an international component that has been shown to lower volatility over long, long, long periods of time. So thank you for all those great questions. They were lovely. We appreciate them very much. And if you have short ones like these, just send them in at talkingrealmoney.com. One of two ways. You can type them if you like to type, hit the ask a question button, or speak them if you like to speak them for the Friday podcast. You click the mic button. The other thing you can do, if you have a longer question, you want somebody sometimes you guys will write us with the list of everything in your Hodgepodgitis portfolio, you know, like 30 different funds and stocks and things and go, what do you think of my mix? Well, that's really hard to do on a podcast. Plus, it's kind of gonna bore the audience. So we like to bore just Tom or one of our other advisors at Apello Wealth. I'm looking to be bored. Yeah, you can bored them. And honestly, we decided a long time ago that because we can't answer those very well on the show, that we would make our advisors, at the time it was just the two of us, so it was easy then. Now it's a little harder, but we still are making our advisors available to you for free. No obligation, no high pressure sales pitch, period. Uh-uh. Not gonna get it. Just go to talkingrealmoney.com, click on meet an advisor, and you can meet an advisor. Simple as that. Thanks so much for being a part of our podcast. Join us, well, it's Monday, so tomorrow, for another exciting or less exciting edition of Talking Real Money.

Podcast Disclosures

SPEAKER_00 28:26

The opinions and views expressed on this podcast were current on the date recorded. Opinions, estimates, forecasts, and statements of financial market trends that are based on current market conditions constitute our judgment and our subjects change without notice, including any forward-looking estimates or statements which are based on certain expectations and assumptions. Although information and opinions given have been obtained from or based on sources believed to be reliable, no warranty or representation is made as to their correctness, completeness, or accuracy. Information presented on the podcast is not personalized investment advice from Apello Well. The views and strategies described may not be suitable for everyone. This podcast does not identify all the risks, direct or indirect or other considerations which might be material to you when entering any financial transaction. Past performance does not guarantee future results, and profitable results cannot be guaranteed. We hope you realize that the information provided on Talking Real Money is for informational, educational, and hopefully enjoyable purposes only. The podcast is not trying to get you to buy or sell any financial products or securities. Instead, the program is provided as a public service by Appello Wealth, a fee-only registered investment advisor. Please see Appello Wealth's ADV Part 2A on our website for information regarding Appello's fees and services. Apellot Capital, L L C D B A Apello Wealth, is an investment advisory firm registered with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The firm only transacts business in the states where it is properly registered or excluded or exempt from registration requirements. Registration with the SEC or any state securities authority does not imply a certain level of skill or training. Apello does not provide tax or legal advice, and nothing either stated or implied here should be inferred as providing such advice. Thanks for listening, and please visit talkingrealmoney.com for more information and important disclosure related to performance of any specific index or fund quoted in this podcast.