Future Proof Jobs?

SPEAKER_00 0:05

You're gonna do a really great financial future. Tom and Don are talking real money.

Introduction to Real Money

Graduation Season Insights

SPEAKER_02 0:12

The Times, they are a change in. Ladies and gentlemen, hi, welcome to Talking Real Money, the all things money program that uh airs just about every single day of the week, at least weekdays. I'm Don McDonald, Tom Cox over there. You're listening, we're glad you're doing that. That's really important to us because if you weren't there listening, there would be no point in us doing this. So, you know, thanks. Anyway, we want to talk about something a little bit different today, and I know this is not a topic that is necessarily top of mind for most of our slightly older, albeit not elderly like us, audience. We're old. Uh this is the it we're coming up, it's it's graduation season. And when we put the when we put this up, it's gonna be May. And that means that kids are graduating from high school and college, and they're they're going out into the world thinking, or particularly graduating from high school, but let's let's say college too. And they're they're going out in the world thinking, okay, what am I gonna do? What's the next step? What am I gonna learn? What am I gonna do to get a job now that I'm out of college and I've got this degree? What's it worth? What's it gonna make me? Hey, I'm gonna, I've got an education degree, I'm gonna be a teacher and make$43,000 a year if I can find a job. You what are you gonna do with the future? That is uh and in this age of artificial intelligence and uh automation, what are you or your children or your grandchildren going to do? What's the next step? How do they decide where to go with their earning future? They've got decades of earnings potential ahead of them, and I think they're desperately in need of some great advice.

SPEAKER_03 2:01

Yeah, and oftentimes you and I do not agree on the topics for this program. No, we discuss them all the time. We read a lot of stuff, and yeah, I don't like that, and you like that, I don't like. But in this case, I happen to agree with you because when you sent this article to me, it it's daunting. It's huge. It's from the New York Times, very lengthy. I read it the first time, I was like, that's pretty good. Then I read it the second time, like, this is really good. And then I read it one more time. I shared it with our entire staff here because as you may or may not be aware, most of the people here are relatively young, and they have most of their earning career ahead of them, too. Because this is a such an important topic that I absolutely loved it. It was authored by a woman named Jody Cantor, who's a reporter. I think she's taught at Columbia as well. It's really good. But the second paragraph starts with the line you're graduating, talk to the graduates you just mentioned, into a job market unlike any we've known. Wow, which is a pretty strong statement if you think about it, because I graduated from college and when I came out, we were in the middle of a horrible deep recession, too, and people said you're just never gonna get a job. Well, of course, I got a job. Wasn't the job I wanted.

SPEAKER_02 3:18

But uh Wait a minute. Okay, what was your what was your major? History. And what job did you think you were gonna get with that? That is a great question. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:30

That's point one. Yeah, that's that was a liberal arts education. Okay. So there you go. Yeah, that's fair.

SPEAKER_02 3:37

And what wait what was the first job you got out of college? The radio gig. Sure. That follows.

SPEAKER_03 3:44

Yeah, makes sense. I was reporting on history. History. Uh, so there you go. Okay, so but she spends a lot of time unpacking kind of what work can and cannot mean to you. She says um work can bring satisfaction, fellowship, and pay. Now, I argue a little bit about the fellowship part because we don't see each other very much at work. It's not like the old days. I know, but not like the old days where we used to be hanging out and all that. Those kind, it's kind of hard. Um, but the here's the here's the important part that I think anybody, and as you said, if you have younger people in your family, important lessons. If you're a younger person, she says she wants you to harness two forces that power the best careers, craft and need. Now I thought she was talking about craft beer, but apparently not. She's talking about actual development of a craft that you can use.

SPEAKER_02 4:36

Aaron Powell Yeah, these were very unique uh approaches. These are very unique approaches to finding the work that you want to do, that you're passionate about. What do you need and what crafts can you bring to the work?

SPEAKER_03 4:52

Aaron Ross Powell She says most successful fulfilled people practice a special thing that they know how to do that other people do not. Fascinating sentence if you think about it, right? I mean, because there are certain jobs, like I think she mentioned firefighters, they rely on rules and knowledge passed through generations, et cetera. And there's other, you know, jobs where come in and start to do this today. But she says, and I think this is absolutely right, your craft is truly yours and cannot be taken away. And I think every person needs something like that in their life, right?

Discovering Your Craft

SPEAKER_02 5:27

I think everybody has a craft. They just don't know it. And and maybe this is something that should be done uh in high schools and colleges, is to help kids find that craft. This makes so much sense to me, just on a on a personal level. And I see it in you. Your craft is communicating with people. That's your craft. You're you have special skills at that, particularly one-on-one communicating.

SPEAKER_03 5:55

That's something that's been developed, by the way. I wouldn't have thought 30 years ago you could say that about me, but that's maybe, but not to the extent of the city.

SPEAKER_02 6:00

Well, wait, a craft is a thing you develop. That's true. Every craft, every craft, woodworking, electronic. Not you can elect that one's out. I can't do that. Yeah. But it's a craft you can develop. Music, a craft you can develop, uh design, it's a craft you can develop. Uh writing, a craft you can develop. Find a craft because the crafts make you valuable. It's a very much human skill.

SPEAKER_03 6:28

Yeah. She mentions that, and here's another pretty interesting line. College can be a surprisingly tough place to find your craft.

SPEAKER_02 6:37

That's a pretty provocative statement. Trevor Burrus, Jr. Well, but it makes sense. I mean, think about it in your case. Was there any craft teaching really? Or it was just when you're learning history.

SPEAKER_03 6:47

Trevor Burrus, Jr.: Learning to read and to write and to be analytical about those things. You could say that. But not on a craft basis.

SPEAKER_02 6:54

It was mainly it was not learning to write to appeal to someone. For example, learning to write nonfiction uh historical staff.

Tracking Actions and Preferences

SPEAKER_03 7:05

Yeah, right. Yeah, that's true. That's true. Um but here's here's my favorite part of the entire article that I mentioned to the staff a couple of times because I think this is at the end of the day so important for anything in your life. She writes, um every week, make a practice of writing down which actions you enjoy and which ones you hate, whom you like being around and whom you can't stand. I think that's just a fascinating thing because that will help you narrow things down, right? Like, well, I really like doing, but I really don't like doing that. I can tell you what those things are my life, but I'm not gonna say them on the show. Because there's things I love and there's things that I do because I have to.

SPEAKER_02 7:45

I know what they are because he tells me all of them. But I'm not giving it away.

SPEAKER_03 7:49

No, I'm not telling you. And then she talks about, okay, here's another part that's fascinating because she she plays on something that that that I know well because I lived through it. Um talks about kind of the what is the the thing de jour, right? Uh she says, every generation gets a version of learn Japanese. She reflects on the fact that 40 years ago it was all about. Yeah, because the Japanese were following their business practices and their real estate, all that kind of thing. So then it was uh you know well, and she she quotes one word, plastics. You remember what movie that's the graduate. The graduate, of course, right? Because we're old. We remember that movie. The graduate. It's fascinating. So which is a harder thing to do because that means you have at in the moment you have to grasp whatever thing that is. I don't think that's as important as knowing your you're sort of and I think we can say craft is a skill set, right? It's a skill set. And you you develop that. Um she does say something else here that I think is worth was important to me. And and because I think I so worry about like my daughter who wants to get into psychology and she's already got a roadmap and all that kind of thing. And I think when I started college, I had no idea, right? Of some things I'd done, but I didn't know what direction I was doing.

SPEAKER_02 9:05

Well, you forget she's she's only about half you.

SPEAKER_03 9:09

Hopefully the good half.

SPEAKER_02 9:10

Yeah, hopefully she got that good half.

Seeking Guidance and Mentorship

SPEAKER_03 9:12

I'm gonna like but but figuring these things out. This is another part that I think not done enough today. I offer it all the time to my employees, our employees. Sometimes they take me up on it, sometimes they don't, and that is getting help from she talks about alumni, older adults, and anyone who has achieved a measure of success, trying to use others to figure this out, right? Because others can oftentimes look at you objectively and say, hey, here are the things you're really good at. You know, these are and you should be working on these things uh rather than going it alone. Because she says it's hard to do this alone. I totally agree with that. I think it's very and I've I have mentored people, I continue to mentor people. If you're interested in this business, I've talked to many of you to try to say, do this, don't do that, and to get to know you in a way that'll help you decide where to go in it. But um, fascinating piece.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

I like doing that.

SPEAKER_03 10:05

I know you do. You're you're you're good at that.

SPEAKER_02 10:07

And you know, it's funny, my daughter is very much the same. Um is she? Oh, and a recent just her recent past uh illustrates what we're talking about here. My daughter could not in college figure out what her major was going to be. Started off graphic design, went to theater, and went to education. You know, she was all over the place. She she came out of school, she was a teacher for a year. She wanted to educate because she has this need to help people, but she hated teaching, hated, hated, hated teaching, hated it.

SPEAKER_03 10:41

And she had a tough teaching gig. I mean, it wasn't like a lot of people.

Personal Takeaways from the Article

SPEAKER_02 10:45

One inner city and one she got the dregs of the the fourth grade. Uh so she went to get her master's in because she likes design and technology too. So she got a master's from NYU in um in learning interfaces, learning technology and user interfaces, which is a very, very specific one. And she just got a a new job designing uh these materials for a water treatment company. The they they don't know design. They they're engineers and they're bad at design. And she just started and she absolutely loves it because it's she found her craft, which is designing user experiences. It's not in an educational she didn't this was outside the box. This is not in the education business. This is outside of it, but it is still stuff that educates people about what this company does. And she found her craft. I love that.

SPEAKER_03 11:50

There's a couple things I think in a general sense I take away from this article because I'm not looking for a job, obviously. In fact, I'd like to have fewer jobs. Uh so I but but to anybody, just going along in life. Number one for me, by the way, is this article. It it it to me it relates to a lot of things I hear from you about investing. Because a lot of people say, well, I wouldn't want to do it now. I wouldn't want to put any money in now because things are unsettled. Uh well, I got news for you. Things are always unsettled, and we just look back a year ago when things felt even more unsettled with the tariffs and everything. Yep. I mean, emerging markets, for example, are up about 60% a year. What's happened the last year? A year ago, yeah. A year ago. And it's the same for me when it comes to going out and getting a job. If you sit around and go, well, I need to be understanding the Japanese style of business or this and this. No. You need to focus on the things you're good at. Just as you said, Don, you need to develop that craft. The rest of the world's gonna do whatever the rest of the world's gonna do. You gotta think through what you're good at and and and accentuate the positive. Number two, I love this. Really do, because I I say I recommend this to people all the time when they feel really good about their money, which maybe you should be feeling really good right now, is to write down how good you feel. And then when it's bad, write down how bad you feel. That's the same in this article saying keep track of the things you really like doing. Look at you. You brought it right back around to investing. I know. And then the other one is and this is hard. Because you're built.

SPEAKER_02 13:17

I think they're all hard so far, but I think so.

Listener Questions and Answers

SPEAKER_03 13:20

But you're built how you're built. But when you're young, you should take some chances. I hate to say it because that's the time to reach. That's the time to not just take the safe traveled path and say, I'm gonna try this because I'm 23 and it might or might not work. But and and I think she says this in the article as well. Um, I love this. This is just fascinating.

SPEAKER_02 13:41

Yeah, it is a great article. The uh the the title of the article is This Is a Hard Time to Start a Career. These two words can help. It's from the New York Times, and uh it is written by a Jody Cantor, who is really a terrific writer.

SPEAKER_03 13:56

Yeah, she's writing a book be out soon, I think it said.

SPEAKER_02 14:00

So it's very, very good stuff. The other thing we like to do, in addition to sharing these things that we find, these little nuggets, is try to get your questions answered because we want to help you do what you need to do. And you can ask us questions very simply by going to talkingrealmoney.com and clicking on the ask a question button and either recording it or sending in a note to Tom. And some of those questions, we're just gonna sit down and have a conversation with you like this. Stan, welcome to Talking Real Money. Thanks for calling.

SPEAKER_04 14:32

Yeah, well, thanks for taking my call. Listen, Don, I was just wondering what you think of these 100% buffered ETFs for the S UI, like uh PMAP or CPSP. Those are for April, but there are others for various months, particularly in a taxable account where I don't really aim for or I don't really want or aim for income. The income is taxable to me federally. I'm talking about a fund like BND. Sure. So these buffered vehicles they produce capital gains or sometimes losses. They have uh moderate expense ratios, true greater than BND and other bond funds. And you've said many times that bonds are neither for income nor potential gains, although gains and losses are possible depending on interest rates. But rather the bonds are primarily for stability. Now, at least in theory, these kind of buffered ETFs, the most they can lose is the expense ratio, which is around 0.7%, something like that.

SPEAKER_02 15:51

Right, right. That's the worst case in their short duration.

SPEAKER_04 15:56

Right. But I've got a couple questions. The prospectus says something about counterparty risk. And I've noticed, at least for the most part, trading volumes in these kinds of buffered ETFs, they're not very big. Obviously, BND is very, very, very liquid. These are sometimes quite thinly traded. So what do you think? Stability?

SPEAKER_02 16:27

I mean Yeah, I I I am not a big if you've listened for a while, you know that neither Tom nor I are. Yes, I know. We're big we're not big fans of complexity. And these are designed to be purposefully opaque and complex. They accomplish what they set out to do in good markets, in good markets, which is to give you a little sliver of the return of those markets. And it is a very little sliver. For example, right now in PMAP, which is the PGIM S P 500 April buffered ETF, the one they've returned over the past year a little over 8%. The index, the SP 500, has returned 28%. Yeah. I understand. So you're only one getting a sliver of that. You're only getting that when the the that index does eight percent or better. If that index does less than eight percent, you're gonna get whatever it does. So if it's a five percent year, you're gonna get five. And in a bad year, you're going to get negative half a percent, roughly.

SPEAKER_04 17:39

But my point is this would be replacing a fund like BND, like bond funds, which can give, you know, that certainly they throw off income, but they can also lose a lot of money sometime.

SPEAKER_02 17:51

And I was looking at the Trevor Burrus, again, that's that's that's actually that's been very, very rare for an intermediate-term bond fund to lose a bunch. The only reason we saw that happen was because we had this incredibly, ridiculously unexpected 20-year bull market in bonds that we that was something that that that hasn't happened ever in the past. So we had we had a big bounce from that or a big drop from that in in that uh coup we've had a couple of those little declines, and then a big one. The other thing about these is that uh I don't like anything that adds a level of uncertainty to, and that counterparty risk is part of it. Uh that really what they're saying is that there's the risk, although I let me give you a great analogy. This will help a lot. Uh many years ago, I sat on a homeowners association board, and actually it was in 2008. Bad year to be on an HOA board. 2007 is when I started my term, and I was the treasurer. And I wanted to know what we had our short-term capital invested in. So I contacted the broker that the management company had, and I said, What are we invested in? He goes, Well, auction rate notes. I said, Okay, I know what those are, but explain to me what the deal is. He said, Oh, yeah, they're they're long-term bonds that have liquidity because they're they they uh trade at an auction every day. So there's always liquidity. So you can get your money anytime you want. I said, but what if nobody bids on them? He goes, Well, that's never happened. I said, but what if there's no one on the other side of the trade? What happens to the bonds? He goes, they become long-term bonds and you could lose money on them. I said, No, that's too dangerous because you know it it could happen that somebody back, even though it's not happened in 20 years, it could happen. So I put all that money into CDs. A few months later, the auction rate note market collapsed. And I mean collapsed. It was a disaster. I don't want to own anything that is in a market that I don't fully understand or grasp or or where there is this counterparty risk. I don't want it. And what counterparty risk means, it's really simple. It means you enter an agreement into an agreement with somebody to do something, they they agree to give you this return on these things, and then for some reason the market doesn't cooperate with what they wanted and they back out. And then your fund goes to zero, possibly. Well, zero not zero, but a major loss, possibly. And I'm not saying that's likely. I just don't want that uncertainty when I can get a high degree of historic comfort from owning let's not own BND. Let's take the risk totally out of the equation. Are you ready? Build a five-year ladder of CDs.

SPEAKER_04 20:50

Yeah. Well, but as I said, I don't necessarily want or need the income.

SPEAKER_02 20:55

Want or need the income. That's a tax what again, it's the tax tail wagging the dog. Maybe, but I'm you're talking about the difference between maybe a twenty-five percent tax and a fifteen or a twelve. But that's a tax. That's only a portion of the return that goes to the government. The other thing you could do is build a ladder of municipal bonds. That's gonna give you a realistic tax-free yield. Realistic. These I believe are unrealistic. The expectations are set high because they're trying to sell something.

unknown 21:28

All right.

SPEAKER_02 21:29

It's a concern I cannot it's a concern I cannot prove, but I have over the past how long have I been in this business? Forty years? I've seen all kinds of things that I had bad, terrible feelings about because of their complexity fall apart. Collateralized mortgage obligations, collateralized debt obligations, auction rate notes. All of these things had almost certainty of giving you a slightly higher return with no risk. And it turns out the risk Wasn't obvious until it was.

SPEAKER_04 22:02

The other thing is these kinds of funds don't really have a long history.

SPEAKER_02 22:07

One or two years is one or two years, yeah. And oh, and I forgot to mention that light trading, because these are exchange traded funds, they trade like stocks, the bid ask spread can be really big. Which means you can pay more to buy, and you're not gonna get as much when you sell. I've seen some big spreads in the Yeah, and and again, that's a that's a risk that is uncertain. I don't see what the point is. I'm not gonna I gotta tell you, I would never suggest it to our general podcast audience ever.

SPEAKER_04 22:42

Okie dokie. Okay, sir.

SPEAKER_02 22:44

Thanks for your opinion. That's why I called. Dan, we appreciate you listening and uh enjoy the rest of your week. Take care. But we also mentioned that you can type your questions up, and then Tom gets to read them, and we try to answer them, hopefully. I haven't seen these questions. They're totally new to me. Just like a caller would be. Oh, well, I can do comments. You'll have a comment. Thank you very much. Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 23:13

You're good at that. Uh from Eugene, Oregon, Jeff writes us. Hi, Don and Tom. Not so much a question, but more of a comment. I'm listening to the annuity tricks episode while working, and I find it ironic. I'm setting up annuities for clients for the RIAA work for. I shake my head every time I go through the firms, uh, the forms, rather, to see how much the advisor is making, all the fees, surrender charges, more. Seems like most of the clients are moving funds from IRAs and 401ks into annuities, like there's no tomorrow. Anyway, just an observation I'll never quite understand. Keep up the great work.

SPEAKER_02 23:48

You work for somebody who call who is a registered investment advisor who is supposed to be a 100% fiduciary, and they're selling, they're having people roll their IRAs into, and you looked, you looked at the paperwork and you discovered that they're getting commissions. This is not a true 100% fiduciary. This is a perfect example of the kind of firms we talk about all the time. The vast majority of financial advice firms out there do not always act in the client's best interest, and the firm, sir, that you work for does not. I assume you're just doing it for the paycheck, not because it makes you feel warm and fuzzy for doing the right thing for clients, because your boss is not doing the right thing for clients.

SPEAKER_03 24:32

No, uh uh the annuity part, but especially taking qualified money and putting it into an annuity, which I really dislike. Um we appreciate your the honesty.

SPEAKER_02 24:42

I mean that that's that's compounding the sin. Yeah. That's just there is no advantage to putting tax already tax-advantaged money into a tax-advantaged annuity because you don't get double tax advantages. You only get one and you pay extra for those tax advantages. No. Makes no sense.

SPEAKER_03 25:02

Um from Glendora, California, DK writes I have a question. If a husband retires at full retirement age, this is a social security question, so God help us. And gets$2,000 a month Social Security benefit, can his wife collect 50% of that benefit at her FRA? The wife doesn't get SS benefits on her own because she hasn't worked to have enough credits. So this will be a total of$3,000 a month in payments to husband and wife combined. Yes. Yeah, right. Yeah. So the only time that's reduced would be uh if she took it prior to her full retirement age. So if she took it before what is full full retirement age now is 67, I believe. Yeah, 67 for those retiring now. So yeah, you'd pay a price for that, uh, but otherwise she'd be entitled to half of what her husband's retirement benefit would be from Social Security. So pretty good deal. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02 25:58

Yeah, it's a really good deal. And and the thing is, is that if your spouse took it early and was could take it early, had had enough credits uh at 62, when that spouse gets to 67, they can kick up to that half.

SPEAKER_03 26:14

Now it will be slightly reduced. It will not be the full half.

SPEAKER_02 26:17

Won't be the full half, but it's close.

SPEAKER_03 26:18

It's close.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

It's it's usually more for a lower-earning spouse unless you were a high-earning spouse.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

Yeah. Uh I got another question/slash comment comes from Chris.

SPEAKER_02 26:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 26:29

Who writes me, I talked to him and uh I talked to him about somebody who was uh another advisor, excuse me, who was uh pitching him on some products. And um I said, I said, um, why would you want to pay so much for a particular bond fund? Uh I think it was Pimco Income Fund.

SPEAKER_02 26:49

Yeah, it's expensive.

SPEAKER_03 26:50

Which is expensive. Um and it also I think has a commission attached to it, I believe, right?

SPEAKER_02 26:54

It can, yes.

SPEAKER_03 26:55

It can, yeah. So and the response from the advisor I love this. I do truly. So thank you for sending this to us, Chris. The advisor wrote the following. There are certain asset classes where I think it makes sense to pay more in fees. International, small cap, and value. A bond manager can make up half a percent fairly easily. Then uh the advisor talks about how the Vanguard total bond wait, let me finish. The Vanguard total bond it was down more than the Pimco income fund year to date. Well, now, of course, those are two very different funds for one thing. The Vanguard Total Bond is a holding of the entire bond world or percentage thereof. Pymco income is operated entirely differently, so I don't know how you can make that comparison.

SPEAKER_02 27:41

They the the it's it's wow, it's apples and cumquats. Thank you. Yeah, not even close. The Pimco income fund is a complex, actively managed hedging, short selling, uh really dangerous. I mean, they if things went badly for them, and again, they always look great right up until they don't. And I don't know when or if they're gonna look badly, but if they do, this fund, they've got to be really adept at hedging because uh about 15 percent of their uh over 25 percent of their portfolio is low grade paper, but they also uh short bonds. They also borrow money, they they leverage I mean they have their most funds that own fixed income have somewhere around 98 percent of their portfolio in fixed income securities and about two percent in cash. It's a rough, rough figure. Uh matter of fact, let me just pull B and D up. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_03 28:49

That's gonna be probably even more in bonds less than they may have a little flush there because they've got to pay things out with a little bit of a little bit of cash because I want to make this this comparison is so powerful.

SPEAKER_02 29:00

If you think Pimco income is similar, you're you're you are a bad, bad advisor.

SPEAKER_03 29:04

Trevor Burrus, I think he's just looking at performance and saying one's done better than the other. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02 29:09

Yeah, he's looking at performance and says one's one's done better than the other. But here's the thing: let's look at the portfolio of BND. Vanguard total bond index has 98.42 percent of its portfolio. I was close. Yeah, you were close. In fixed income and 1.58 in cash. Okay. Now let's look at Pimco income. They have 174% of their portfolio. Hold on. Think about that number for a minute. They have 174% of their portfolio in bonds. What? For every dollar they have in the fund, they're borrowing 74 cents to buy more bonds. That's leverage, like I mean, that's ridiculous leverage. Oh, oh, and by the way, they're short 7%. And they have negative 56% in cash.

SPEAKER_03 30:09

And what do they want to charge you for that, the pleasure of uh having that management?

SPEAKER_02 30:13

If if you get the class A shares, it's only 90 basis points, but the A shares also have with them a commission of 3.75. If you get the Pimco income, I've I just lost it. I just had it on my screen. PIMCO Income Class C, which doesn't have a front load, it's a tricky little back-end liar load fund, then your fees are 1.65% per year. Whoa. So yeah, you can overcome an extra one point six percent per year over BND, or what is BND charging these days? Hold on.

SPEAKER_03 30:55

Three basis points or something like that. Three basis points.

SPEAKER_02 30:57

So it's over three basis points. It's over one point six percent more expensive every year. They have to make one point six percent more every single year than Vanguard makes just by holding the bonds.

SPEAKER_03 31:10

Okay, but that and that goes right to the point I was gonna make where the advisor says, you know, it makes sense to pay more in fees in particular asset classes. That has been an argument for as long as I can remember, frankly. Uh because you're gonna you've got to just pay more there because uh Well, you get what you pay for. Yeah, exactly. So and and history has proven that not to be accurate. You go look yourself. There's a thing called the SPIVA that uh that you can go right online. You can look at the funds, and uh even if you could say the performance has been better on a fund, the likely outcome is it will not continue to be. So that's a lousy argument. Um, and in this particular case, as Don just pointed out, no comparison in any way, shape, or form.

SPEAKER_02 31:54

Well, let's say, for example, that there was a huge crash in the bond market. I'm not saying this is gonna happen, but let's say there was no market for bonds at all, and the values dropped by forty or fifty percent just because the economy was so bad nobody could buy them. Because you have leverage at a large decline like that, 40 or 50 percent, you're gonna hit zero in your fund because of the borrowing. You have the potential to hit zero dollars in the fund. Is that safe? Doesn't sound like it to me. But you see, they think they they're claiming they're so adept at at dodging and you know, weaving.

SPEAKER_03 32:35

They're fast.

Episode Wrap-Up

SPEAKER_02 32:35

Yeah, we know what's gonna happen in the future. Well, until you don't. Wow, that was a lot of stuff in one episode.

SPEAKER_03 32:44

Yes, it was. Uh it was, you know, again, um love the article, love the questions and comments. So thank you for all that. And guess what? Uh my dance card not as full as it was a couple months ago because retirement is kind of in the rearview mirror.

SPEAKER_02 32:58

You didn't even know you could dance.

SPEAKER_03 33:00

Not well. Uh that's probably why it should be in the rearview mirror, a long way in the rearview mirror. So if you'd like a look at your portfolio, if you'd like to talk to a planner, if you'd like to talk to me, it's all ready, available to do by going to talkingrealmoney.com, click on meet an advisor. And guess what? If you want a question, we've got a lot of questions lately, so thank you for all that. You can type them in, you can speak them in. It's all at talkingrealmoney.com because we're here to help.

SPEAKER_02 33:28

And because we're here to be talking real money.

SPEAKER_00 33:33

The opinions and views expressed on this podcast were current on the date recorded. Opinions, estimates, forecasts, and statements of financial market trends that are based on current market conditions constitute our judgment and are subject to change without notice, including any forward-looking estimates or statements which are based on certain expectations and assumptions.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

Although information and opinions given have been obtained from or based on sources believed to be reliable, no warranty or representation is made as to their correctness, completeness, or accuracy.

SPEAKER_00 33:55

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SPEAKER_01 34:28

See Apellow Vox, ADP, to any other website for information regarding public fees and services.

SPEAKER_00 34:33

Apellot Capital, LLC DBA Apello Wealth, is an investment advisory firm registered with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The firm only transacts business in the states where it is properly registered, or excluded or exempt from registration requirements. Registration with the SDC or any State Securities Authority does not imply a certain level of skill or training. Apello does not provide tax or legal advice, and nothing either stated or implied here should be inferred as providing such advice. Thanks for listening, and please visit talkingrealmoney.com for more information and important disclosure related to performance of any specific index or fund quoted in this podcast. I think I need a nap.