Ep. 2002: The Buggy Whip Theory

unknown 0:12

You just never know.

SPEAKER_03 0:14

You just never know. You just never know. Yesterday's a thing is a buggy whip and so the slice of everything rolls a lot of financial physics. You just never know. Oh, settle from a nice one, fill it up in 1931. You just never know. You just never know. You just never know. Yesterday's your thing is a big whipping soul. All the size of everything and let the market roll. That's a law of financial physics. You just never know. Making money. Make sense. Talking real money.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

You just never know. No, you just

Market Uncertainty

SPEAKER_02 1:01

never know. You never know what the market's gonna do, you know, you know. That's what this show is about. And today, today, is the Monday special financial physics edition of Talking Real Money. Hello, everybody who listens to us and uh is listening to us right this minute. And and I'm not gonna say hello to those of you who aren't listening this minute because you're not there. That's what would be the point. I'm Don. Over there is Tom. We're here to, well, make money a little easier to deal with by making it more sensible and logical. And one of the tools we use in guiding us is the good book. We look to the good book, The Laws of Financial Physics. Yes, and when it comes to money, other things we can have other good books. It's about money. There isn't a lot of money in the other big old good book. Well, there is a little.

SPEAKER_04 1:55

No, there's there's some things about money. There's moneylender stuff, yeah. But this is Rule 14, as we continue. We're already up to 14. I know. Well, the author keeps these skinny so they're easy to get through, which I like. I like skinny. I wish I was skinny. Anyway. We can

Buggy Whip Theory

SPEAKER_04 2:12

all dream. This is such an important chapter because uh we all believe that we know what's going to happen next, whether it be in business, in life, in sports, whatever it is. And uh this is so I just love this chapter because it points out how wrong. Wait a minute.

SPEAKER_02 2:29

What's the name of this chapter?

SPEAKER_04 2:30

Oh, pardon me. The buggy whip theory. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:33

Actually, I don't even think it's a theory. I think it's a fact.

SPEAKER_04 2:36

I think it is a fact.

SPEAKER_02 2:37

I mean, we've we've seen it happen. I mean there was a time when you could make a good living making and selling buggy whips.

SPEAKER_04 2:46

I'm sure the last guy making them thought he was pretty special when he had 100% of the market, right?

unknown 2:51

I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 2:53

I mean, whatever. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:57

You know, I'm gonna actually, while you uh uh ramble on for a minute, I'm gonna look up buggy whip manufacturers.

SPEAKER_04 3:03

I'm sure you are. Okay, but the chapter starts out talking not about buggy whips, but about ice and how in the early decades of the 20th century everyone had an ice box which required delivery of ice to keep the food fresh.

SPEAKER_02 3:20

It's funny, my wife and I collected antiques for many years, and in our house we have two vintage gorgeous ice boxes with the the tray, and in fact, one of them the you you load the ice in the top and it closes the lid, and it has a a water trough down at the very bottom that catches the dripping because it drips, and uh that's how you kept your food cold. And the ice man would come every couple of days, bring those big tongs. Yep, carrying in the big ice. Carrying those big blocks of ice. And you know where they got those big blocks of ice? Because they didn't have refrigeration. Somewhere north. In the winter, they would go out on the rivers and lakes and they would harvest these big chunks of ice, and then they would store them in a giant concrete or brick building with thick walls lined with straw and insulating material to keep that ice from melting over the summer.

SPEAKER_04 4:18

And guess who they stole that technology from, by the way? I happen to know this.

SPEAKER_02 4:22

The Romans or the Greeks?

SPEAKER_04 4:23

Yeah, it was the Romans, actually. They went up to the Alps and got ice and stored

Ice Turns Obsolete

SPEAKER_04 4:28

it in the ground the same way. Pretty fascinating. And that I think that was like 2,000 years ago. Anyway, people used ice to keep things cold. And so that required ice boxes, Don just mentioned. That also required ice delivery. But then came along this innovative thing called the refrigerator, uh, which kind of eliminated. Let's see, I love these prices. Says to buy a new refrigerator back in 1927 between $300 and $500, the cost of a new car. Which would you buy, by the way? Would you rather get the ice, the refrigerator, or the car? I guess you have to go to the floor.

SPEAKER_02 5:02

I would probably get the refrigerator. Yeah, I think you would. I I would probably get the refrigerator because generally speaking, we weren't traveling long distances by car then. Good point. Um by the way, I do have the buggy whip information. This is actually fascinating. In in 1892, a lar uh a conglomerate was formed. Uh the big buggy whip makers, I guess seeing that the writing was handwriting was on the wall with the first.

SPEAKER_04 5:30

The whipping was on the wall, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:32

They they consolidated all of these disparate whip making companies into one gigantic whip company called the United States Whip Company. Shocking.

unknown 5:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:43

It was the world's largest buggy whip manufacturer, and they stopped making whips in the early 1920s.

SPEAKER_04 5:51

So my previous comment was kind of right. I mean, the last week. It was kind of kind of buggy. We thought we're doing it pretty good here. We've got corner on the market here.

SPEAKER_02 6:03

What happens when nobody buys buggy whips?

SPEAKER_04 6:06

And then you didn't hear anything about whips until what was it, the 1980s when the song came out Whip It Good and all that stuff, right? That kind of disappeared. No? Okay. Uh at any rate, the point of the matter here is at all. Didn't intermike. Never ice companies went by-bye. Uh yeah. Let's see, when when you mention here Southland Ice.

SPEAKER_02 6:29

Southland Ice, which was one of the bigger ice companies in the country. I love that I've got to be a company. And if Southland sounds familiar, think about it for a minute. Yeah. It used to be the Southland company that owned. It was in the song. Yes. 7-Elevens.

SPEAKER_04 6:46

That's right.

SPEAKER_02 6:47

Now they're owned by

No One Knows Winners

SPEAKER_02 6:48

a Japanese conglomerate.

SPEAKER_04 6:49

They are, yeah. Anyway, so the the point, and and you go through other examples the author does, of what things have become obsolete, right? Which is that that's the point of the of the uh uh the buggy whip theory.

SPEAKER_02 7:02

And yet a lot of investors don't, you know, it's like I don't want to own a company that's gonna go belly up. Yeah. Well, you're going to. You really are. You can't avoid it because you can't know right now what's going to fall apart before it falls apart. You just can't know it.

SPEAKER_04 7:21

And I think I think it also points out that you can't know what could be great in the future. Think of also think back, 1930s.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

Okay. Uh I wasn't there, but I wasn't either, believe it or not.

SPEAKER_04 7:33

You go for your first ride in a Ford tri-motor, which is a popular plane in the 1930s, and you think this is pretty cool. What if people could fly from here to, you know, uh San Francisco? Yeah. The airlines. I want to invest in the airlines. How's that turned out? Well, it was good at the time. It was, but over the long haul, airline stocks have underperformed just the general stock market. Right. They require a huge amount of capital, the costs are high, and they're very cyclical. Um, and then I think it's even more fascinating in a technology, right? Streaming, because you point out, I believe in the book somewhere where I read that you know the streaming has replaced movie theaters in a way, not entirely, but that it's kind of heading that way.

SPEAKER_02 8:16

Well, okay, let's go back to buggy whips for a moment. Um, there are still like uh people who dr have buggies in Central Park, or they race them. You know, they they so there's still there's still a demand for a few buggy whips. And you still go out and you buy ice at 7 Eleven. Good point. You just don't buy it as often. It's not being delivered every day. So things change and and you and it's so the the the change is less than obvious.

SPEAKER_04 8:49

Yeah, and I'd say not beyond that, even if you're up on the even if you know in advance about the change, investing in the right part of that guy, and look at streaming. Would you invest in the people making the content? Would you invest in the providers of that content? Would you prov you know invest in the builders of the internet? Which which place would you put the

Streaming Changes Everything

SPEAKER_04 9:09

money?

SPEAKER_02 9:09

But we we we have to admit, though, that streaming did change the way we consume entertainment dramatically. That it's with that we saw the demise of a number or the the the struggle of a number of cable companies that used to stream it into your house. Very few people watch over-the-year broadcast television anymore. Very, very few. If they're if those in fact, I would imagine that a lot of stations are struggling right now, a lot of television stations.

SPEAKER_04 9:38

Except those, excepting all the political advertising they're making attacking.

AI's Unclear Winners

SPEAKER_02 9:41

Well, but that's a temporary thing.

SPEAKER_04 9:42

And what about today? Today you've got, of course, the investment in AI. Should you be investing in the people that make the chips, people that do software that's making it all work together, companies that are most impacted by I mean, there's all these angles that make investing and trying to say, here's what the future is going to look like so very difficult. That's what I love out of the author on this chapter. In this chapter, pardon me.

SPEAKER_02 10:05

Well, and and AI is the perfect example. There were a lot of people, myself included, who knew that something like this was going to happen because we sit and we watch technology. I mean, I was watching the advancement over the decades in in language, speech recognition software, because I use it a lot. I've used it since IBM came out with it, and it was at Epcot in like the 80s. Uh this is technology that I've been following, but the problem was along the way, you you kind of felt it coming, but you didn't know where to put your money. You didn't I I can tell you that 10 years ago, nobody thought NVIDIA was going to be a primary supplier of chips to artificial intelligence. They were a gaming company, basically.

SPEAKER_04 10:51

Yeah, it turned out rather well. So it always comes back to okay, even if I could have seen the future, even if I know what's coming, even if I'm Don McDonald sitting around watching technology, which I I don't know what that means, but I because I I watch technology all the time.

SPEAKER_02 11:07

Is that a show? Is that anyway? It should be. Maybe that's my next podcast. It might be watching.

SPEAKER_04 11:12

So what do you what do you do? Well, I think it's pretty obvious is you don't guess about the future. You you don't make guesses or this has to happen because it doesn't have to happen. Number two, I think you gotta remain diversified because you don't know even if you knew in advance about streaming or AI, any of those things, which part of it to invest in would be very difficult. And here's the other one that I see regularly.

Tune Out FOMO

SPEAKER_04 11:37

You don't suffer, you you you figure out how to tune out the FOMO because this is where people really get in trouble, where somebody tells them, This is great, man, you got to get in on this, I gotta get my piece of this. That's where I see people make bad decisions with their money.

SPEAKER_02 11:52

Yeah, you just never know. Oh, you just never know.

SPEAKER_04 11:57

And so wait, you have two of the uh the ice coolers. Do you still have buggy whips laying around the house too, then? Or what's the deal?

SPEAKER_02 12:04

You know, the thing about buggy whips is I think they wore out. You know, so they didn't make it to antique stores. And so and the nice thing about the ice chests is that they stir serve as storage containers for stuff. I don't know what's in them, but I'm sure something is stored in them. Probably should look and see. There's probably stuff I don't even want. But it's stored. But you know, when it comes to the uh to the future.

SPEAKER_03 12:29

You just never know. Oh, you just never know. Yesterday's your thing is a buggy whipping so own a slice of everything and let the market grow. That's a law of financial physics. You just never know.

SPEAKER_02 12:41

Yes, that's the laws of financial physics. Another another Monday. We have many more to come. You just never know. Now we come to the part of the program that uh we look forward to every day. And that's the time when Tom gets to And oh, by the way, before we get to this part, Tom, I got a note. I don't know if I forwarded it to you or not from a listener who said It sounds like I hope you didn't, but okay. Yeah. Does Tom know that he can just read the questions off his computer or his iPhone? He doesn't have to print them.

SPEAKER_04 13:20

I but then the war on trees would come to an end. That would be shocking development. We can't have it.

SPEAKER_02 13:25

Given the state of wars in this world, we can't we can't stop one. Good lord. We need to keep starting them.

SPEAKER_04 13:31

By the way, somebody else wrote, somebody else wrote about that and said, please only print this on recycled paper. So yes, I do use recycled paper and then I recycle it. So the war on trees is hypothetical to some extent.

SPEAKER_02 13:45

Yeah, then there's no war. That's a good point. The trees are won or something. You're not doing a good job there, dude. All right, so that means it's question time. That's that's these things you sent in to us at talkingrealmoney.com using the ask a question button. You typed them up, Tom printed them up on recycled paper, thus ending the war on trees, and then using his voice, read them to all of us because we're dying to hear.

SPEAKER_04 14:11

Yeah, I I think it's a truce, not the end of the war. Just putting that out there, okay? Oh, ceasefire. So go on. Ceasefire might go on. Uh, from Fargo, North Dakota. It's one of my favorite films. One of my favorite films of the 80s. 80s? I think it was the 80s. Yeah, probably. Ah, Sean. Love the tripper shred tripper tripper shredder. Uh, hello, gentlemen. Even they use that to recycle.

SPEAKER_02 14:33

Yeah,

Rebalancing, Not Timing

SPEAKER_02 14:34

well, lots of things.

SPEAKER_04 14:36

Uh hello, gentlemen. Even Christine Benz seems to be advocating for some market timing, of course, after the fact. It would be informative to hear your comments on her article. Quote, in this market, do less has its limits. Thanks.

unknown 14:51

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_04 14:51

So we both read the article.

SPEAKER_02 14:53

Yeah, we both had to break down and read the article because the implication is that she's become a market timer.

SPEAKER_04 15:00

That's what he's saying. I read the article and I just read re rebalancing. That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02 15:07

Here's what what I came up with. It it's it basically she says if you invest, then your portfolio at some point will no longer resemble the one you originally started with. We say that all the time. All the time. Because, you know, certain parts of the market do well and then others don't, and you've got to uh that's where it and then she says, rebalance, trim the stocks back towards your intended allocation and then redirect the proceeds into other assets. Uh and that certainly I nowhere in that article, nowhere in that article did I get the impression that she was saying, you know, the market's about to crash, get out and uh wait and then buy something later.

SPEAKER_04 15:49

I think that's a good thing. This is an awkward time, I'd say, for rebalancing with bonds having fallen recently and stocks continuing to go up. So what you would be doing likely is selling some of those particular stocks, you know, hopefully not individual equities, but types of, you know, large cap, et cetera, small, because small's had a great year, emerging markets, and buying bonds, right? Because you'd be buying the thing that has gone down. That's the struggle. So uh no, and Christian somebody we know and respect.

SPEAKER_02 16:18

It's something we've been advocating forever. It's just a long time. It's portfolio maintenance, it's not market timing.

SPEAKER_04 16:26

Fair enough. Uh, let's go to Tempe, Arizona, where I wish

Bond Fund Questions

SPEAKER_04 16:30

I was. Thomas writes us. I'm looking at VTEB Drop Like a Rock, which is the Vanguard.

SPEAKER_02 16:37

Is the name of the fund Drop Like a Rock?

SPEAKER_04 16:39

Drop Like a Rock. That's bad branding, I gotta say. Uh, this is the Vanguard Municipal Bond Fund. Okay. Thomas writes, it's down eight percent from its high. I have $300,000 in a non-qualified money fund, and I'm considering allocating $50,000 to the fund. Should I be concerned about bonds dropping in lieu of rising rates? I live in Arizona. I would certainly enjoy the state tax savings because 100% of this fund is in treasuries.

SPEAKER_02 17:09

Now, I wait No, no, it isn't. No, I don't think so. No, no, no. As a matter of fact, it's not exempt from Arizona tax at all.

SPEAKER_04 17:19

Isn't it municipal bonds? I don't think it is. Yeah, it's municipal bonds. So it's not treasury.

SPEAKER_02 17:24

BTEB is municipal bonds, so it's U.S. Correct tax exempt.

SPEAKER_04 17:29

But not AZ. Um I'm currently having order to sell the October 16th puts, five of them, which would obligate me to buy 500 shares of 46, even lower than it is now.

SPEAKER_01 17:40

What?

SPEAKER_04 17:40

I'm concerned about the duration risk of 7.2%. Should I be, I'm just looking for some tax-free yield, but I'm worried this fund might drop further. What are your thoughts? I have about two million dollars in my portfolio, half of which is Roth. I realize income will also affect my Medicare premiums, but that should not be an issue this year. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 17:59

Well, okay, go. Can you go back a minute? Yes. What yield did he say he was getting?

SPEAKER_04 18:03

What yield? Yeah, didn't he say? No, he said he currently has an order to sell the October 16th puts, five of them. What was that 7%? Uh he's concerned about the duration risk of 7.2, 7.2 years, I believe.

SPEAKER_02 18:17

Oh, 7.2 years, okay.

SPEAKER_04 18:21

Um, okay, first of all, if something's gone down and you're thinking about buying it, that's a good time to buy because you get more shares at a lower price. Number two, buying it based on current situation, that's no reason to buy or sell anything.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

Nope. Because you're trying to predict the future. And it was all over his question, by the way. He kept saying, if rates continue to rise, is this a bad deal? Yeah. But what if they don't?

SPEAKER_04 18:44

Yeah. You should be looking at your overall asset allocation, how much in stocks, how much in bonds. Then, while considering the tax situation, you should be deciding should this be, you know, like regular taxable bonds or municipal bonds. That's a decision you have to make based on your taxes.

SPEAKER_02 19:00

Yeah. Because if if you're bra Although the current current 30-day SEC yield on VTEB, this is the good side of it. Maybe it's down. The value of the shares is down. Yep. But the yield is up to 4.4% free.

SPEAKER_04 19:16

Yeah. Pretty good money. But that's not a reason to buy it today. The reason to buy it today is you need bonds in your portfolio and you want to get tax-free interest from those bonds. That's the reason. It has nothing to do with what's going to happen to rates or where it's been the last, you know, and that's by the way, I look when I look at VTEB year to date, the performance is down three and a half percent. So I don't know what he's doing.

SPEAKER_02 19:39

See, I think he's looking at share price because it's dropped from a high of 51 to I think it's about 47. Um So he's looking at a share price drop, and then but not factoring in the yield, which is which goes to your total return. The total return figure you're quoting is includes the the yield.

SPEAKER_01 19:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:59

Uh this is a very, by the way, this is an amazing portfolio. This is 10,000 primarily investment grade municipal bonds.

SPEAKER_04 20:08

And what is the expense ratio?

SPEAKER_02 20:12

Three one-hundredths of one percent.

SPEAKER_04 20:15

You get ten thousand issues. You're getting it for almost nothing, and Vanguard has a good reputation for managing bonds. They're pretty careful about what they buy. So, I mean, I think it's a good fund if that's if you need municipal bonds. But that's a decision you need to make. It has nothing to do with the current interest rate situation at all, because that's how people get in trouble.

SPEAKER_02 20:39

Yeah, that then your market timing. Yep. Yep. And what you want to do is just build the right portfolio for you, understanding that segments of it are going well, okay, unless you're in actually fixed bonds that you're holding to maturity or CDs, your entire portfolio is going to fluctuate and you will never be able to control the direction thereof.

SPEAKER_04 21:01

Thank you. Of anything. I mean, I we just heard from David Booth last week at a conference I was at, and he pointed out correctly, and he did in his book, that the reason you've made more in stocks is the uncertainty. And he said, in your life there's uncertainty. Not everything is guaranteed to go in a certain up into the right direction. Wouldn't it be nice? But we can't make that guarantee.

International Allocation Basics

SPEAKER_04 21:24

All right. Uh from Ridgefield, Washington, Gary Wright says, Thank you for your commitment to the Talking Real Money Podcast.

unknown 21:32

What's your job?

SPEAKER_04 21:34

I think oh, I I thought you'd been committed or something. Uh well, I'm committed to it because it's my job. Okay. Don, I love the music, Tom. I even enjoy the bad humor. Well, that's so kind of you. Um people are so tolerant of you.

SPEAKER_02 21:49

You're like, you know, I get I get I get criticized, and you're like, oh, but Tom, he tries so hard.

SPEAKER_04 21:56

Well, as long as he's trying, he's really trying. It feels like fifth. Great all over again when he does two. He says, My question is about international equity allocation. If you were recommending a 40% international exposure, would that be 40% of equities or 40% of total assets? Keep up the good work. And please print this question on recycled paper. This is where I got the recycled paper thing from. So 40% of your total or 40% of the equipment.

SPEAKER_02 22:27

So if you have a million dollars in equities in your portfolio, then in my opinion, about $600,000 should be US and about $400,000 should be international.

SPEAKER_04 22:38

But if you want to make it simpler, if you stick with the million and you want to have a portfolio that's 60% in stocks and 40% in bonds, then you take 60 times 40, your international is going to be about 240, right?

SPEAKER_02 22:50

Okay. Yeah. I was just figuring you you had more than that.

SPEAKER_04 22:53

Yeah, okay. So anyway, that the that but yes, that's the equation. It would be a percentage of the equity part of the portfolio, not the overall part. I hope that helps.

SPEAKER_02 23:05

That's that helps me.

SPEAKER_04 23:06

Yep. By the way, when I was back at the advisor summit, they gave me some bad jokes. And the good news is I've forgotten them. So I can't share them now. So stay tuned for that.

SPEAKER_02 23:20

I really appreciate that. Thank you. And thank you all for sharing those jokes with Tom, he said facetiously. Stop doing that. Don't encourage him.

SPEAKER_04 23:32

It makes it worse.

SPEAKER_02 23:33

It makes it, it only makes it worse.

Year-End Planning

SPEAKER_04 23:36

I tell you what's other also been fun here in October. We're still in October, right?

SPEAKER_02 23:41

Yes, sir. This is October.

SPEAKER_04 23:42

Well, I didn't know because by the time we record these, I don't know if they get aired in January. Lots of conversations recently because people realize we're coming up, hard to believe, towards the end of the year and they want to be all set for the brand new 2027? Are you kidding me? 2027. So um happy to have those conversations with you. You just go to talkingrealmoney.com and click on Meet an Advisor. It's that simple.

SPEAKER_02 24:07

See, now I thought when you were talking about October that you were going to plug my uh scary story podcast, but apparently not.

SPEAKER_04 24:14

Is that out now?

SPEAKER_02 24:15

It is. It's yeah, I've got like 25 scary stories uh on on Frightly. F-R-I-G-H-T-L-Y. Frightly podcast.

SPEAKER_04 24:24

I'll do it. But should I wait till I get home or I'm gonna drive off the road?

SPEAKER_02 24:28

It's in the top 100 of Apple Fiction podcasts because of course it's October. It does really it's gonna it's gonna have a big October and it'll have a terrible November. Yeah. But that's okay because then my seasons readings podcast picks up then.

SPEAKER_04 24:39

You've got something for every time.

SPEAKER_02 24:41

I have nine. No, eight short story podcasts right now. Wow. I'm trying to I think I have to trim that down. I think it's too many.

SPEAKER_04 24:50

Diversify, diversify, diversify.

SPEAKER_02 24:52

I am diversified in my podcasts.

SPEAKER_04 24:54

I love it. Yeah, good stuff.

Follow The Podcast

SPEAKER_04 24:56

So take a look at that.

SPEAKER_02 24:56

If you want to find all of them, here's the plug shortstoryverses.com or the short story versus channel on Apple Podcasts. And by the way, Tom, I discovered something really interesting. And I didn't discuss this with you. I think I mentioned it, but um it's the the Apple podcast rankings, you know, where where we we kind of end up in the top 50 to 100 most of the time.

SPEAKER_04 25:18

Somewhere in that area.

SPEAKER_02 25:19

Um those are not just based on how many downloads you get. They're not even based on how many listeners you have. They're based on ongoing, get this ongoing new listeners and the followers. That's why everybody says follow me. Follow, hit the follow button. It's that follow button that really gets us traction uh with uh with the charts. So and and I and charts are important, they may be annoying, but they're important because what charts do is they're they're an they're a discovery tool. People want to listen to or watch what other people are listening to or watching. And so they go to the charts and they go, Oh, I want to listen to the top money podcast, not the bottom. Uh so it really is important to us and to, of course, my short story podcast, that you click follow.

SPEAKER_04 26:19

Thank you for doing that. Thank you for the five.

SPEAKER_02 26:20

It's so easy to do, and it doesn't cost you anything.

unknown 26:23

No.

SPEAKER_04 26:24

And thank you for the questions, which you can send us more. You can do them recorded if you want to have Don play him back on Fridays. You can have them typed so I can chill some more trees. Well, kind of kill trees.

SPEAKER_02 26:35

Yeah, you're not killing trees if you're recycling.

SPEAKER_04 26:38

I hate it. I gotta think that through some more.

SPEAKER_02 26:40

And if you really want to be uh I'm sorry, if you really, really are committed to this battle, then what you have to do is start cutting your own trees. You have them, and then pulping them on property, which means you need a wood chipper.

SPEAKER_04 26:56

Back to Fargo.

SPEAKER_02 26:57

Back to Fargo. And then you gotta pulp them, and then you gotta press them. You ever made your own paper? It sounds like a lot of work. Did you ever do that in school? I think we did it in school once. And it was like you make this gooey, goopy stuff and then you press it out on a cloth that sucks up all the moisture and you get like papyrus or something. I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 27:17

No, but I'll take your word for it. That and the ice, you seem to know both of them well.

SPEAKER_02 27:22

Well, I mean, I knew the ice because I had to research that for my fascinating book, Financial Physics. Thank you all for being with us. We appreciate you so much. And if you appreciate us, click follow. Click follow.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

Follow, follow, follow, follow, follow.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

What's that from, Tom? What musical?

SPEAKER_01 27:38

I don't know. Follow, follow, follow, follow.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

The Fantastics.

unknown 27:42

Ah.

SPEAKER_02 27:42

Try to read the kind of September. And I am going to go away now because we're talking real money.

SPEAKER_00 27:56

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